A Pagan's Theories on Recinarnation

[AnimeSpirit]

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

One of the ways other religions attack Christianity is this turn the other cheek mentality. Wrong I am not going to change the standard of my faith to accommodate any other religion. I too have read about every religion I can find to read about. They do all have one common theme they are jealous that our Father did not choose them as his number one people.

Please don't be offended by my saying so, Isaac, but I find it amusing that you consider the "turn the other cheek" mentality an attack when the "turn the other cheek" concept originated from Jesus Christ himself. -Matthew 5:38-42, NIV, The Sermon on the Mount.

Seriously Isaac, is it really your opinion that I or my fellow Pagans are jealous of Christians?

I can't speak for other religions, but Paganism is an extremely flexible practice. Craft users are allowed to live their lives any way they wish so long as they follow the Pagan's Rede, "As you harm none, do as you will." This is an extremely tall order that includes every possible definition of the word "harm." You could say that it's our "One Commandment."

Jealousy plays no role in the path whatsoever. To be jealous of another person or group is a personal choice. I've never seen any Pagan group or body instruct its followers to be jealous of others. What would be the point?

[vixweb]

Originally Posted by AnimeSpirit

I can't speak for other religions, but Paganism is an extremely flexible practice. Craft users are allowed to live their lives any way they wish so long as they follow the Pagan's Rede, "As you harm none, do as you will." This is an extremely tall order that includes every possible definition of the word "harm." You could say that it's our "One Commandment."

That speaks volumes by its' self. What a SHALLOW interpretation of reality! And easy- So, basically, you believe that when you die you will come back as a butterfly or a tree? Is what you come back as totaly random, or does it concern your "kharma"? Again, good luck with that.....

[AnimeSpirit]

Originally Posted by vixweb

That speaks volumes by its' self. What a SHALLOW interpretation of reality! And easy- So, basically, you believe that when you die you will come back as a butterfly or a tree? Is what you come back as totaly random, or does it concern your "kharma"? Again, good luck with that.....

I'm not sure what you mean by saying the Rede is "shallow," but it's certainly a tall order. It includes everything that the ten commandments include and much more. It implies that the only evil we have to worry about is the suffering that we do to each other. It places the responsibility for our wrong decisions on our own shoulders and our free will and not in the hands of some evil entity or devil (whom Pagans don't even acknowledge).

As for what our vessels are, that depends entirely on your tradition. Some traditions honor animals to such a degree that they'd consider it an honor to reincarnate as an animal (i.e. wolves, lions, tiger, etc.). On the other hand, some trads believe human souls only reincarnate as other humans. Some trads even believe that the individual soul chooses its vessel before rebirth.

I, for one, could care less what I came back as. When it happens, I won't know the difference.

[Isaac-Saxxon]

Originally Posted by AnimeSpirit

Please don't be offended by my saying so, Isaac, but I find it amusing that you consider the "turn the other cheek" mentality an attack when the "turn the other cheek" concept originated from Jesus Christ himself. -Matthew 5:38-42, NIV, The Sermon on the Mount.

Seriously Isaac, is it really your opinion that I or my fellow Pagans are jealous of Christians?

I can't speak for other religions, but Paganism is an extremely flexible practice. Craft users are allowed to live their lives any way they wish so long as they follow the Pagan's Rede, "As you harm none, do as you will." This is an extremely tall order that includes every possible definition of the word "harm." You could say that it's our "One Commandment."

Jealousy plays no role in the path whatsoever. To be jealous of another person or group is a personal choice. I've never seen any Pagan group or body instruct its followers to be jealous of others. What would be the point?

I got your other cheek Anime. I will not walk in your house and attack your religion and if I did I would turn the other cheek. If you walk in my house and attack my faith I would knock you on your ass. I know you would not do that but that is my point. Christians are not door mats and I do not have to be a nice guy all the time. When it comes to what I believe as you have seen I will hold the line with no apologies. Yes other countries and peoples are jealous of the USA and UK I hope you can see that

[AnimeSpirit]

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

I got your other cheek Anime. I will not walk in your house and attack your religion and if I did I would turn the other cheek. If you walk in my house and attack my faith I would knock you on your ass. I know you would not do that but that is my point. Christians are not door mats and I do not have to be a nice guy all the time. When it comes to what I believe as you have seen I will hold the line with no apologies.

If you came into my house and attacked my religion, you wouldn't be in the position to turn the other cheek or not as you'd be the one attacking me. If I came into your house and attacked your religion, I'd be stupid not to expect a good @$$ kicking on the way because I'd be very rude and disrespectful. In either case, whether it's you or me turning the other cheek, it is in no way an attack on Christianity.

I'm not a doormat either, Isaac, and I certainly don't expect you to be. My patience and tolerance of direct, intentional rudeness and dishonor (regardless of the basis of such conduct) are quite limited. When that line is crossed I'd gladly welcome the bad karma that comes with giving some jerk the @$$kicking of his life for insulting or dishonoring me. It's a matter of respect and propriety, not religion.

I have far more patience for people who accidentally insult me out of ignorance or curiosity. I let those slide all the time without a second thought.

Now that we're past that, let's talking about religious intolerance for a moment. No one here is insulting anyone's religion. I have no more against Christianity than I do against any other world religion. I have total faith in my own practice, but I am not rude or disrespectful enough to put down anyone else's beliefs. "To each, his own." Anyone who tries to deny religious freedom to someone else for ANY reason, in my book, is on the list with Adolf Hitler and Osama Bin Laden.

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

Yes other countries and peoples are jealous of the USA and UK I hope you can see that

Yes, I can agree that there are countries that are jealous of the American way of life, but not because of religion. I do not consider myself more precious to the divine simply because of where I live.

[piemaker720]

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

I got your other cheek Anime. I will not walk in your house and attack your religion and if I did I would turn the other cheek. If you walk in my house and attack my faith I would knock you on your ass. I know you would not do that but that is my point. Christians are not door mats and I do not have to be a nice guy all the time. When it comes to what I believe as you have seen I will hold the line with no apologies. Yes other countries and peoples are jealous of the USA and UK I hope you can see that

I don't know about Anime but I for one don't like your post. I have not read anywhere on this thread someone calling a christian a door mat. Futhermore you are the only one that is talking knocking people on their ass. I don't see anywhere where your religion is being attacked. You are sounding more like someone from another country, talk about my religion and I'll kill you. I don't have to be nice either but if this is what christianity teaches people to act like then I don't want no part of it. I also have your other cheek. I don't believe in attacking someone's beliefs but I also try not to be rude.

[Isaac-Saxxon]

Originally Posted by piemaker720

I don't know about Anime but I for one don't like your post. I have not read anywhere on this thread someone calling a Christian a door mat. Furthermore you are the only one that is talking knocking people on their ass. I don't see anywhere where your religion is being attacked. You are sounding more like someone from another country, talk about my religion and I'll kill you. I don't have to be nice either but if this is what Christianity teaches people to act like then I don't want no part of it. I also have your other cheek. I don't believe in attacking someone's beliefs but I also try not to be rude.

A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice.-- Bill Cosby
I do not like your post either PIE ! You are attacking what I believe and being rude as you take a stand for Paganism. What is it you do believe ? Not using capital letters for one. "Christianity" ! The Bible makes is real clear what God thinks about Pagans and many of them were destroyed for their Pagan practices. If I slip up and crack on Pagans in your home get mad get rude what ever but when I crack on them in my home well you already know what will happen Life is short and eternity is long so we live by our decisions. You might believe you will come back as a monkey or some other creature. I plan on being me forever. Yes we all have choice in this life but the next will be very different. Anime I do not dislike you I just do not agree at all with you.

[piemaker720]

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice.-- Bill Cosby
I do not like your post either PIE ! You are attacking what I believe and being rude as you take a stand for Paganism. What is it you do believe ? Not using capital letters for one. "Christianity" ! The Bible makes is real clear what God thinks about Pagans and many of them were destroyed for their Pagan practices. If I slip up and crack on Pagans in your home get mad get rude what ever but when I crack on them in my home well you already know what will happen Life is short and eternity is long so we live by our decisions. You might believe you will come back as a monkey or some other creature. I plan on being me forever. Yes we all have choice in this life but the next will be very different. Anime I do not dislike you I just do not agree at all with you.

Again Issac no one has said anything bad against Christianity, no one. If they have feel free to point it out. Another thing, I AM NOT A PAGAN, where do You get off accusing me of something you know nothing about. I said if Christianity teaches people to act the way you are acting I want no part of it, but no where did I SAY I was a Pagan. You accuse me of believing in reincarination but no where have I said that, in fact I believe in neither. You accuse me of taking up for Pagans, where have I done that? I jump in when your attitude starting getting threatening, I don't believe no one should be threatened because of their beliefs, has anyone threatened you for your beliefs, NO. I would like to know one thing from you, Who do you consider Christians? Baptist, Pentecostal, Presbyterian, Mormans, Jehovah's Witnesses, Methodist, I could go on. Are all these considered Christians? You clearly didn't consider people in other countries Christians. By the way my not using caps is just another thing for you to gripe about uh!

[Isaac-Saxxon]

Originally Posted by piemaker720

Again Issac no one has said anything bad against Christianity, no one. If they have feel free to point it out. Another thing, I AM NOT A PAGAN, where do You get off accusing me of something you know nothing about. I said if Christianity teaches people to act the way you are acting I want no part of it, but no where did I SAY I was a Pagan. You accuse me of believing in reincarnation but no where have I said that, in fact I believe in neither. You accuse me of taking up for Pagans, where have I done that? I jump in when your attitude starting getting threatening, I don't believe no one should be threatened because of their beliefs, has anyone threatened you for your beliefs, NO. I would like to know one thing from you, Who do you consider Christians? Baptist, Pentecostal, Presbyterian, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Methodist, I could go on. Are all these considered Christians? You clearly didn't consider people in other countries Christians. By the way my not using caps is just another thing for you to gripe about uh!

I ask you I did not say that you were either !! You are not picking up on the analogy. I did not say I would kick your ass I said I would reserve the right if thing warrant such action. Not likely going to ever happen. Now I said other peoples too and maybe if you spent some time in the history books and read about the migrations you could speak from a point of view that is not a knee jerk reaction. You can believe in bacon that is fine with me. When you practice a religion that believes in destroying mine then shame on you. Islam and communistic peoples are top on the list.

2 Timothy 2:15
"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."
KJV

[piemaker720]

< You are attacking what I believe >

Again where have I done that?

< you take a stand for Paganism.>

That's not saying I'm Pagan!

<The Bible makes is real clear what God thinks about Pagans and many of them were destroyed for their Pagan practices>

That's not attacking what Anime believes in?

[LateNight]

It's this mentality of "I'm right, you're wrong" and I don't care what YOU say.

There are of course certain absolutes in this world. Then there are things that certain ones of us BELIEVE to be ABSOLUTES, with or without proof. That's where the whole 'faith' comes in..

Personally I can enjoy these types of debates, up to a point. Before they get hateful, before they turn into attacks.

Not everyone is capable of having such debates.

Personally, I believe on the 8th day, God created Rock 'n Roll

The weekend is almost over, the weekend is too short.. Saints play.. it's do or die time... New Orleans vs Tampa Bay.. down in the dome. 3:15pm

[Princess Leia]

Originally Posted by piemaker720

Again Issac no one has said anything bad against Christianity, no one. If they have feel free to point it out. Another thing, I AM NOT A PAGAN, where do You get off accusing me of something you know nothing about. I said if Christianity teaches people to act the way you are acting I want no part of it, but no where did I SAY I was a Pagan. You accuse me of believing in reincarination but no where have I said that, in fact I believe in neither. You accuse me of taking up for Pagans, where have I done that? I jump in when your attitude starting getting threatening, I don't believe no one should be threatened because of their beliefs, has anyone threatened you for your beliefs, NO. I would like to know one thing from you, Who do you consider Christians? Baptist, Pentecostal, Presbyterian, Mormans, Jehovah's Witnesses, Methodist, I could go on. Are all these considered Christians? You clearly didn't consider people in other countries Christians. By the way my not using caps is just another thing for you to gripe about uh!

Just one point - a person can be a part of any organized religion = Baptist, Mormon, Catholic, etc. That doesn't automatically make them a Christian. To be a "Christian" you have to live a life like Christ. You have to believe that He laid down his life for you - so you may have ETERNAL life. I know many people who are parts of churches both big and small and are headed strait to Hell. Not trying to be ugly, that is just the black and white of the situation. One has to accecpt the free gift of eternal salvation that God so generously gave to us through His Son - Jesus. So, no, Pie - not all of the above are considered Christian, unless they have asked Christ to come live in their hearts and be the Lord of their whole life. God's gift is open to all who will recieve it. All he wants is for the person to be his child.

[joepole]

>To be a "Christian" you have to live a life like Christ.

No, you don't. You have to simply believe that the Big J was the son of God and came to Earth to be killed for us.

[piemaker720]

Originally Posted by Princess Leia

Just one point - a person can be a part of any organized religion = Baptist, Mormon, Catholic, etc. That doesn't automatically make them a Christian. To be a "Christian" you have to live a life like Christ. You have to believe that He laid down his life for you - so you may have ETERNAL life. I know many people who are parts of churches both big and small and are headed strait to Hell. Not trying to be ugly, that is just the black and white of the situation. One has to accecpt the free gift of eternal salvation that God so generously gave to us through His Son - Jesus. So, no, Pie - not all of the above are considered Christian, unless they have asked Christ to come live in their hearts and be the Lord of their whole life. God's gift is open to all who will recieve it. All he wants is for the person to be his child.

I fully understand what you are saying. But it guazes the heck out of me when people claim to be a Christian and do the opposite of their teachings or to have a preacher talk about the right and wrong way to live according to the gospel and turn right around the next day to do what they said was wrong to begin with. To me that is two-faced and NO I am NOT referrind to Isaac, this I have witnessed in life. I have seen deacons drink alcohol and go to graet lenghts to hide it. I have seen a preacher with his secretary on his going after it [accidently seen]. Then look at all the child molesters on the news. So I am glad when you said "a person can be a part of any organized religion = Baptist, Mormon, Catholic, etc. That doesn't automatically make them a Christian."
You know I have had Mormans come by my house, I listen to what they say even if I don't agree but I am not rude to them, and I thank them for coming. I don't want for my house to be known as where the *******s live. I have even taken some of the Mormans crayfishing, these people were from Utah and wanted the experience. Each person has their own beliefs and that is fine. But just because Anime is Pagan doesn't make him a bad person and I respect that.
I have read in the bible that Christians were stoned, whipped, and hung on crosses but then all people can say is how pagans were treated. Who was it that was treating Pagans that way?