Mother Teresa Struggled With Her Faith

[MattyMattyChooChoo]

Isaac, you know nothing of the Catholic Church, traditions, "agendas", true Christianity. You sound like you've seen the DaVinci Code a few dozen time too many. You completely dodged the issues I addressed, and made up a story about the Church and "mind control". What mind control and agendas does the Church have? The Catholic Church is just about the only church that holds a steady position regardless of secular society. Abortion is wrong, homosexual acts are wrong, premarital sex is wrong, women in the priesthood has no theological basis. These are things which our society and other non-Catholic denominations have widely embraced, yet the Catholic Church has not wavered.

The traditions in the Mass are designed in such a way that promotes worldwide unity. You can walk into any Catholic Church in the world and have basically the same Mass. Not so for any other Christian denomination.

Finally, the teachings of Christ through the Catholic Church (founded by Christ himself) teach on the basis of reason and logic. We don't get a little book that says "this is wrong, this is right, end of story." There are full detailed explanations with biblical references to support. I encourage you to research more deeply, the truth about the Catholic Church.

[Isaac-Saxxon]

Originally Posted by MattyMattyChooChoo

Isaac, you know nothing of the Catholic Church, traditions, "agendas", true Christianity. You sound like you've seen the DaVinci Code a few dozen time too many. You completely dodged the issues I addressed, and made up a story about the Church and "mind control". What mind control and agendas does the Church have? The Catholic Church is just about the only church that holds a steady position regardless of secular society. Abortion is wrong, homosexual acts are wrong, premarital sex is wrong, women in the priesthood has no theological basis. These are things which our society and other non-Catholic denominations have widely embraced, yet the Catholic Church has not wavered.

The traditions in the Mass are designed in such a way that promotes worldwide unity. You can walk into any Catholic Church in the world and have basically the same Mass. Not so for any other Christian denomination.

Finally, the teachings of Christ through the Catholic Church (founded by Christ himself) teach on the basis of reason and logic. We don't get a little book that says "this is wrong, this is right, end of story." There are full detailed explanations with biblical references to support. I encourage you to research more deeply, the truth about the Catholic Church.

I can agree with some of what you posted. Have your ever read about Debra or Huldah ? What about Tehpi or Scotia ? You are right about being able to walk in any Catholic Church and get the same reading or teaching as you may any week of the year. Matty I am not saying people that practice Catholicism are not Christian ! I have no right to judge a soul. I find the
DaVinci Code to be flawed in a major way FYI ! You can be Catholic or any other "denomination" and still be my friend. The fact that Christianity is a reality and not a religion or denomination is my point. Man wanted a king and he got one Saul and from there things went down hill. Traditions of man that cover the truth about the Bible are wrong !!!

[Pocahontas]

Originally Posted by MattyMattyChooChoo

Isaac, you know nothing of the Catholic Church, traditions, "agendas", true Christianity. You sound like you've seen the DaVinci Code a few dozen time too many. You completely dodged the issues I addressed, and made up a story about the Church and "mind control". What mind control and agendas does the Church have? The Catholic Church is just about the only church that holds a steady position regardless of secular society. Abortion is wrong, homosexual acts are wrong, premarital sex is wrong, women in the priesthood has no theological basis. These are things which our society and other non-Catholic denominations have widely embraced, yet the Catholic Church has not wavered.

The traditions in the Mass are designed in such a way that promotes worldwide unity. You can walk into any Catholic Church in the world and have basically the same Mass. Not so for any other Christian denomination.

Finally, the teachings of Christ through the Catholic Church (founded by Christ himself) teach on the basis of reason and logic. We don't get a little book that says "this is wrong, this is right, end of story." There are full detailed explanations with biblical references to support. I encourage you to research more deeply, the truth about the Catholic Church.

Matty I have some questions regarding Catholics and I sincerely would like to know the answers behind them. I'm not being callous.
1. Why is it almost impossible to get a divorce? Why does it have to be called an annullment as if it never happened when there is a divorce?
2. Why is there confession of your innermost secrets when you can go directly to our Father without anyone else hearing about it?
3. Why can only Catholics take Holy communion in the Catholic church?
These are some of the things that I truly don't understand!
Pokie

[AnimeSpirit]

I'd like to know why nuns, when asked about their views on evolution, respond by hitting you with a Bible.

[vixweb]

Matty-you are quick to point out that the catholic church was started by CHRIST himself, however, you completely miss even THATpoint. Was he walking down the ailse swinging insense? How about wearing the pointy hat? THESE are the kinds of traditions that distract from what JESUS taught.
Agendas? Mind control? Their own relevance is the agenda- "you can't get to heaven but through Catholosism"? You can't get to heaven except through JESUS! That is to say, When you go to confession- you tell the priest your sins and HE gives you your"punishment". I gotta tell ya matty- You don't need a priest for that. If you need forgiveness, talk to GOD! I think if JESUS walked into a "mass", he would tell you to spend your time studying HIS example and the WORD OF GOD-
Again, let me say that Catholics are NOT the only ones with these types of issues. But It makes a great example of the things that CHRISTIANS have become "distracted" by. Of course, we can all get along....this is just a discussion.

[Isaac-Saxxon]

Good post vixweb and Pokie !! I hope others that read this thread will pick up their Bible if they choose and read for themselves the Word and see just how quick they can learn for themselves. I am real surprised Tbelle has not posted to this thread I guess she is busy

[Texasbelle]

Texasbelle has been in Colorado. Just got back and my oh my what a discussion you have all been having. Let me tell you it was great seeing only what God himself created.

I don't know what I can add to this discussion all of my thoughts on this have been been pretty much laid out there already by Isaac, Pokie, Huldah, and Vixweb. It 's interesting to me that the word of God is so very distinctly clear but yet churches and pastors get so caught up in symbols, traditions, money, etc. and forget to focus on the very simple word. And to me it' just that simple the Bible. Study it, learn it , teach it, and apply it.

[Huldah]

Originally Posted by Texasbelle

Texasbelle has been in Colorado. Just got back and my oh my what a discussion you have all been having. Let me tell you it was great seeing only what God himself created.

I don't know what I can add to this discussion all of my thoughts on this have been been pretty much laid out there already by Isaac, Pokie, Huldah, and Vixweb. It 's interesting to me that the word of God is so very distinctly clear but yet churches and pastors get so caught up in symbols, traditions, money, etc. and forget to focus on the very simple word. And to me it' just that simple the Bible. Study it, learn it , teach it, and apply it.

Amen!

Unfortunately I have a lot of problems with the Catholic Church. And fortunately for all of you, I don't intend on shareing them all here.
I was born and raised in the Roman Catholic Church. I went to a Catholic school. I went to mass A LOT. It became clear to me that for many Catholics "Sacred Tradition" is more important than the Word of God. I could litterally go on for hours, but I promise you I won't.
I have to start with the amission that I am far from perfect, and won't even pretend that I am close.
You are each free to choose how you will love and follow our Heavenly Father, and so am I. I choose to do my best to follow God's plan, but to do that I must learn what his plan is. To do that I read and study His Word. I don't claim to say that I can or want to do that on my own. There are plenty of useful tools out there that help. . . . The Smith's Bible Dictionary, Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of The Bible. My mother once told me, "Catholic Priests have interpreted the bible for us for 2000 years, it is not our place to question that." I love my mother very much, but God the Father told us "Cursed be the man that trusteth in man." Jer 17:5.
So, now I say that I will not tell any Christian "you will go to hell if you do not believe as I do." As a very well studied Bible Scholor that I study with says, "Each of us have to sail our own ship." When we face our Father for our final judgment, we will face Him alone. No priest or pastor or reverand or preacher will be standing there with us. So I guess I will decide for myself how I will love my Father, and I will do my best to respect everyone elses personal choice in the matter.
Alleluia (Praise be to God)!

[MattyMattyChooChoo]

Pocahontas has some questions about Catholicism, so here are the answers. (For further reading, "Catholic Answers" www.Catholic.com is a reliable resource for Catholic teaching.

Matty I have some questions regarding Catholics and I sincerely would like to know the answers behind them. I'm not being callous.
1. Why is it almost impossible to get a divorce? Why does it have to be called an annulment as if it never happened when there is a divorce?
2. Why is there confession of your innermost secrets when you can go directly to our Father without anyone else hearing about it?
3. Why can only Catholics take Holy communion in the Catholic church?

1. "Why is it almost impossible to get a divorce? Why does it have to be called an annulment as if it never happened when there is a divorce?" Divorce has become something very popular in the last 40 years or so, and is something obtainable regardless of the Church. However, the Church has was is called an annulment, which is a lengthy investigation to determine if the couple married by their own free will, psychological concerns, etc.. Basically, the tribunal looks to see if there was ever a valid marriage in the first place.

Biblically speaking, a divorced person who remarries is committing adultery (Matthew 19:9 "Whoever divorces his wife except for fornication and marries another woman commits adultery.") When an annulment is granted, basically the Church tribunal says the marriage was invalid from the get-go. An example to illustrate this concept.

A friend of mine was getting married. Part of the marriage conditions in the Catholic Church are that the couple must be here of their own free will, have the desire to get married to each other, the usual. My friend and her husband said yes to all. Many years later, they were divorced and going through the annulment process, when my friend's husband confessed he lied and claimed that he didn't really want to get married in the first place.

This, combined with other factors of the time of marriage, are reason to declare the marriage was never valid in the first place.

2. "Why is there confession of your innermost secrets when you can go directly to our Father without anyone else hearing about it?" This is a great question! Confession was something instituted by Christ after his resurrection as found in the Gospels of Matthew and John (as found below).

The means by which God forgives sins after baptism is confession: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9). Minor or venial sins can be confessed directly to God, but for grave or mortal sins, which crush the spiritual life out of the soul, God has instituted a different means for obtaining forgiveness—the sacrament known popularly as confession, penance, or reconciliation.

This sacrament is rooted in the mission God gave to Christ in his capacity as the Son of man on earth to go and forgive sins (cf. Matt. 9:6). Thus, the crowds who witnessed this new power "glorified God, who had given such authority to men" (Matt. 9:8; note the plural "men"). After his resurrection, Jesus passed on his mission to forgive sins to his ministers, telling them, "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you. . . . Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:21–23).

The above paragraphs follow the concept of "Apostolic Succession", a core belief of the Catholic Church.

A secondary product of confession is the humbling of one's self to tell those innermost secrets. In my personal experience, the sins are not just in my head, but they are now out on the table, in front of the priest, who is not there to condemn you, but to serve as Christ's representative in the forgiveness and absolving of sins(see "apostolic succession").

3. "Why can only Catholics take Holy communion in the Catholic church?" Another great question! Catholics believe that Holy Communion is the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ in what is called "The Eucharist", and that God grants special graces through the reception of the Eucharist.

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is real food, and my blood is real drink. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so he who eats me will live because of me. This is the bread which came down from heaven, not such as the fathers ate and died; he who eats this bread will live forever" (John 6:53–58).

This is a constant bone of contention between Catholics and Protestants, but that is another thread for another day. My goal is simply educating on the belief of the Catholic Church.

Scripture is clear that partaking of the Eucharist is among the highest signs of Christian unity: "Because there is one bread, we who are many are one body, for we all partake of the one bread" (1 Cor. 10:17). For this reason, it is normally impossible for non-Catholic Christians to receive Holy Communion, for to do so would be to proclaim a unity to exist that, regrettably, does not.

Another reason that many non-Catholics may not ordinarily receive Communion is for their own protection, since many reject the doctrine of the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist. Scripture warns that it is very dangerous for one not believing in the Real Presence to receive Communion: "For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself. That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died" (1 Cor. 11:29–30).

Vixweb, you are correct in your assertion that Christ did not institute things like "pointy hats" or "swinging incense". The pomp and circumstance of the Mass are human inventions, all with meaning, and all intended to enhance our worship of God. The climax of our worship at Mass is the Eucharist (see above) which was instituted by Christ himself (see above and John 6:53-58). I encourage you to read this discussion from Catholic Answers regarding the concept of "no salvation outside of the Catholic Church." It may clear up some of your misconceptions.

[AnimeSpirit]

Originally Posted by MattyMattyChooChoo

1. "Why is it almost impossible to get a divorce? Why does it have to be called an annulment as if it never happened when there is a divorce?" Divorce has become something very popular in the last 40 years or so, and is something obtainable regardless of the Church. However, the Church has was is called an annulment, which is a lengthy investigation to determine if the couple married by their own free will, psychological concerns, etc.. Basically, the tribunal looks to see if there was ever a valid marriage in the first place.

Biblically speaking, a divorced person who remarries is committing adultery (Matthew 19:9 "Whoever divorces his wife except for fornication and marries another woman commits adultery.") When an annulment is granted, basically the Church tribunal says the marriage was invalid from the get-go. An example to illustrate this concept.

A friend of mine was getting married. Part of the marriage conditions in the Catholic Church are that the couple must be here of their own free will, have the desire to get married to each other, the usual. My friend and her husband said yes to all. Many years later, they were divorced and going through the annulment process, when my friend's husband confessed he lied and claimed that he didn't really want to get married in the first place.

This, combined with other factors of the time of marriage, are reason to declare the marriage was never valid in the first place.

Wow... Nothing against Catholics or Christians of any kind, but I am SO glad none of this applies to me. Things are so much simpler and natural in my tradition.

[Pocahontas]

Originally Posted by AnimeSpirit

I'd like to know why nuns, when asked about their views on evolution, respond by hitting you with a Bible.

Did you go to Catholic school, Anime? I find that surprising!

[AnimeSpirit]

Originally Posted by Pocahontas

Did you go to Catholic school, Anime? I find that surprising!

No, I didn't. No way!

Actually, it was a friend of mine back years ago who did go to Catholic school. He left Catholism after a nun bashed him in the head with a Bible over a curious question about evolution. He felt it was awfully unChristian to be so violent with a kid over something so small.